Greetings - And Introductions, Please?

[twigsnapper]

Well put Navigator and thankyou.

Most of us understand what you are going through William. Does that shock you to find a forum that REALLY understands more than you think? There are many things here you have mentioned that are no great revelation to some of us. So we don't need to be shocked into understanding. We are already there.

Relax and gear down. A good racehorse has many gears. Also a good racehorse learns to run in company, to draw from the others the drive to go at it and make it to the finish. Don't go all fizzy on yourself. We understand. There is work here to do.

Now back to a question at hand. Just why should any of us spend any time at all on this material? I am not being negative at all, understand. I just want to hear why it is YOU think this material is important. We are not here to dump facts on each other about UFO reports and scientific endeavors.. (If that were the case I could have buried you long ago.) What is important is how and why YOU feel you are responding to this information. What chime are you William and why are you here? Why did the name Townsend Brown make a difference to you and why do you think its connected to the thoughts in your head? twigsnapper

[Mikado14]

Ok, what did I miss? Who is William for I have missed the name and who/whom are the forum elders?

Elizabeth? Have you seen the Mule? Is he OK and can he see?

Mikado

[greggvizza]

Justice,

I have been on this forum since it began in 2004, and all my posts from the last 3 years add up to about an eighth of the amount of words that you posted in one day. Obviously it was a major cut and paste operation; not your personal thoughts.

There is provision for this type of info. It is called a link. Just post a link to a site with info for which you would like the forum to be aware. That way there is only a few links on the page and it is easy to see what you have to say. With all that cut and pasting it is a bit too tedious to try and find your comments in amongst all the noise. Most of the people on this forum have been all through that stuff before.

Have you read Paul’s book on TT Brown? Quite a few of the main characters in the book are actively consulting with Paul. Some are forum participants.

I have belonged to many forums over the years and this is the only forum where I find that I haven’t much to say. Once you get to know everyone you find that there isn’t much that can be said that hasn’t already been said. At that point it becomes and exercise in listening. Listening for nuance.

Most of my life I have been a ready-fire-aim kind of guy, but that just doesn’t seem to fit here.

Welcome to the TT Brown forum.

Gregg

[greggvizza]

Mikado,

You might have missed the signal amongst the noise. William is Justice's real name.

As for the forum elders, I would like to know who they are as well. I picture forum elders in robes with hoods attending secret meetings with the Illuminati.

GV

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Jeez.

Elder indeed. I am not THAT OLD. But borrowing a line from Barbra Striesand .... " Speak quickly, I am getting older here!" .... Paraphrasing of course!

I asked William to join us because I thought that he could add much to our understanding on some of the work that has been accomplished researching the topic of " Black Triangles" And he also had an interest in the things that Gerry Vassilatos had said about Townsend Brown.

And I feel a little responsible that I didn't at that time sort of sketch out what would be the best form to interact with all of you on the forum. I think that William got a full head of steam up, spent alot of time getting his material together, got it all out there, (a massive amount as you all noticed) and now is feeling a little miffed that Paul took the action that he did by locking it down.

I think that all of you understand that Pauls action was entirely proper and his responsibility. I can also see that it came right up against Williams enthusiasm.

I take responsibility for all of that. I am sorry for the upset.

In my defense a little . We are not "burying our head in the sand" regarding Vassilatos as you inferred Justice. He HAS been mentioned quite a bit ... (use the google feature on the side of the main page and just look around at what has been said.) I tried to explain that I just was not inclined to go into such detail in that direction unless we can learn more about who this man was and what his agenda was in writing the piece that he did about Dr. Brown. You have to admit that there were MANY very serious flaws in his "factual account" of Dr. Browns life. Shouldn't we at least raise our eyebrows at that? And until we can know that the man even EXISTS ..... and the material he compiled wasn't a massive disinformation campaign in the first place why should we spend valuable time picking apart his every word?

Ah, this is just too much for my old bones. Elder that I am. I think I'll brew some tea ..... Earl Grey maybe .<g> with some cookies on the side!.. and go to bed early.

Justice. I am hoping that things might look different to you in the morning but if you decide that you can not see your way clear to smoothing your own ruffled feathers then there is nothing more that I can possibly say. Thankyou for the effort you have put out to this point.

Mikado, The mule is fine thank you very much. Still waiting on the wagon to be loaded.
Elizabeth

[Mikado14]

Jeez.

Elder indeed. I am not THAT OLD. But borrowing a line from Barbra Striesand .... " Speak quickly, I am getting older here!" .... Paraphrasing of course!

So what colors are your robe? Also, don't fret, there are a few of us that are not too far behind you.

Mikado, The mule is fine thank you very much. Still waiting on the wagon to be loaded.
Elizabeth

Give him a scratch around the ears for me...he likes that and also an extra handful of oats.....ah hell, make that a handful of "sweet mix", I'm sure he has been a patient ole fella! <g>

Back to my renard work

Mikado

[Mikado14]

Mikado,

You might have missed the signal amongst the noise. William is Justice's real name.

I most certainly did miss it. My "discriminator" (inside joke between engineers) is not functioning and my signal to noise rejection ratio is very....very poor.

As for the forum elders, I would like to know who they are as well. I picture forum elders in robes with hoods attending secret meetings with the Illuminati.

GV

Since all of us are here....does that mean we are the Illuminati?

Mikado

[Chris Knight]

Hi William,

I can see that you have an enormous amount of information on your mind. I know it can be difficult to sort through, and I appreciate that you have found these forums.

Two comments I had after reading your posts:

Vassilatos is an elusive person. I would like very much to talk with him, and I understand that a possibilty exists that David Childress of Adventures Unlimited Press may have some lead on his whereabouts. We all have questions regarding his writings on Townsend Brown. I'm sure that if we could all open up a dialogue with him, it would go a long way in helping all of us sort out the information in our minds.

All of the members in these forums have all come here through different paths and by different devices. One thing that we do is try to help each other bring together our own personal bits and pieces of puzzles into a coherent picture, so we were merely overloaded with information. A faucet is easier to drink from than a firehose kind of thing.

The second comment was regarding LaRC-Si, which was forwarded to me. I was under the impression that it had a very high dielectric constant, but the only reference I have for it is a constant of 3.2, which is not very high compared to say, tedlar. Perhaps you can shed some light on that if I have missed some key information. That line of thought would be best put in the technology section of the forums.

Best regards,

[grinder]

Paul,

Justice might have posted alot of material but some of it was pretty damned interesting. You think that we could re establish a place for SOME of this information. I don't think that there is a Vassilatos post, course there was barely a Bill Moore post so maybe he just didn't make the cut!

See, Justice, this is the problem as I see it. Its interesting stuff alright. But it will be even more interesting when we know more about who wrote these words. I tried finding Vassilatos too without a whole lot of luck. Now it might be that some writers prefer to have the veil of a pen name and I can appreciate that. BUT still, he ought to interact with someone out here.

Otherwise its really easy to say " Hey, he just wrote a pile of sensational crap which he made even more colorful using his own imagination" then he grabbed the money and ran!" And I am supposed to go to the trouble of thinking that his words are worth my time pouring over?

Maybe they are and I am game for that. But I just want more information before I go down that particular rabbit hole. Even a rabbit hole designed to disinform and lead astray might be interesting, if we know ahead of time that s what it is! grinder

[Paul S.]

Justice might have posted alot of material but some of it was pretty damned interesting. You think that we could re establish a place for SOME of this information. I don't think that there is a Vassilatos post, course there was barely a Bill Moore post so maybe he just didn't make the cut!

grinder, I don't doubt that the material that was posted yesterday is interesting and maybe be of some value to our discussions. I just don't think that a forum venue like this is the right place to publish that kind of volume of material. I mean, we're talking like 30 different individual posts and tens of thousands of words!

What Justice should do is publish that material on his own website, and then post here excerpts that he would like to bring to our attention for discussion.

One at a time.

Like somebody else said, let us sip from the fountain, rather than stick our heads in the fire hose.

FYI, Justice's voluminous posts have NOT been deleted. They were locked first, in order to sequester them before the conversation got started, and are now moved to a hidden area of the website. I can move them back, or give you access if you want to see the stuff again, but I would prefer to see a different approach taken if we're going to visit the material.

And, apparently, you're right, there really is no specific place where the Vassilatos material has been addressed. That can also be established, starting with a link to the material on other websites. There is no need to replicate that material here, other than to cite excerpts for specific discussion.

Some may think my methods draconian, but I think they are in the best interest of effective resource management.

--PS

[Justice League]

Mikado,

You might have missed the signal amongst the noise. William is Justice's real name.

As for the forum elders, I would like to know who they are as well. I picture forum elders in robes with hoods attending secret meetings with the Illuminati.

GV

ACtually they are tall "pale ones," robed, and they have council with the Lakota and i am sure other tribes as well.

Not sure about the Illuminati...

[Justice League]

Hi William,

I can see that you have an enormous amount of information on your mind. I know it can be difficult to sort through, and I appreciate that you have found these forums.

Two comments I had after reading your posts:

Vassilatos is an elusive person. I would like very much to talk with him, and I understand that a possibilty exists that David Childress of Adventures Unlimited Press may have some lead on his whereabouts. We all have questions regarding his writings on Townsend Brown. I'm sure that if we could all open up a dialogue with him, it would go a long way in helping all of us sort out the information in our minds.

All of the members in these forums have all come here through different paths and by different devices. One thing that we do is try to help each other bring together our own personal bits and pieces of puzzles into a coherent picture, so we were merely overloaded with information. A faucet is easier to drink from than a firehose kind of thing.

The second comment was regarding LaRC-Si, which was forwarded to me. I was under the impression that it had a very high dielectric constant, but the only reference I have for it is a constant of 3.2, which is not very high compared to say, tedlar. Perhaps you can shed some light on that if I have missed some key information. That line of thought would be best put in the technology section of the forums.

Best regards,

I am sick of vassilatos... I have my own thoughts on what he wrote, I wanted to share them, but they've been locked up, which doesn't make sense to me, but i have no control over it.

I can understand how some people feel the need to interview him, but I am not sure how much one can glean from simply talking to someone person. Now if we could talk to V and 10 of his sources, great, but if the subject matter he speaks of takes place 100 or many decades ago, its just not going to happen.

How could we corraborate anything V says? We can't.

So i prefer to just stick with what i know. If i have time i;ll try to share, as i did before.

Larc-si, dielectric questions, = depends on what it is doped with.

It sticks to just about everything including teflon, last i heard it was being incorporated into ultrathin circuit boards, flexible, due to high K.

Dope it with Carbon Aerogel. INjection mold it with Carbon Aerogel under a vaccum and lets see what amazing things can be done with such a skin?

Coat one side with a conductor, with wire to other side of skin...


><

[Justice League]

Paul,

Justice might have posted alot of material but some of it was pretty damned interesting. You think that we could re establish a place for SOME of this information. I don't think that there is a Vassilatos post, course there was barely a Bill Moore post so maybe he just didn't make the cut!

See, Justice, this is the problem as I see it. Its interesting stuff alright. But it will be even more interesting when we know more about who wrote these words. I tried finding Vassilatos too without a whole lot of luck. Now it might be that some writers prefer to have the veil of a pen name and I can appreciate that. BUT still, he ought to interact with someone out here.

Otherwise its really easy to say " Hey, he just wrote a pile of sensational crap which he made even more colorful using his own imagination" then he grabbed the money and ran!" And I am supposed to go to the trouble of thinking that his words are worth my time pouring over?

Maybe they are and I am game for that. But I just want more information before I go down that particular rabbit hole. Even a rabbit hole designed to disinform and lead astray might be interesting, if we know ahead of time that s what it is! grinder

Look, I need to speak to vasilatos like i need an enema!

Disinformation, pen name, marketing ploy, sure, and why not add, tell the truth and wrap it up in a lie.

I parked my car at 10pm...

If i am lying about parking my car at 10pm and it gets stolen - and i tell the cops t got stolen after 10pm, they are looking for cars stolen after 10pm...

But it doesn't change the fact that car was stolen does it?

Alternatively the best way to lie is to wrap it up in the truth.

I went to a movie with my friend bob at 10 pm.

I went to the movies at 10pm, someone sees me and says, I saw him at the movies at 10pm, but it wasnt with bob, it was with jack.

Does this make sense? Whenever I have found myself assuming things, i often find i am blinded to the truth, assumptions are rationales.

I have heard the question thrown here, what is your agenda, what is vassilatos agenda, etc.

maybe there is no agenda, maybe hes knows some things, maybe he filled in the blanks with intuition, and then made some speculations, maybe he's just like all of us, just a squirrel trying to find a nut.

I think you all give him too much credit...unless the man is 120 years old, there is no way he could know - himself all he speaks of, so he must have hade some source for his apparent knowledge.

My question for him, would be how did he figure it out, since he doesn't give any indication that he has had a first hand experince with anything he writes about, and i suspect he tell me exxactly what i want to hear.

Everyone is focussing on the author - who is he? Who gives a shit, why is it important? If 10% of what he wrote is true and it gets us that much closer to the truth, who cares?

Why aren't we tryint to corraborate the data he presents? Isn't that more important? Why are we ignoring it, before even delving into it? Because he said ttbrown was Tom and not Townsend? I don't care if he called him Dick Tracy or buck rogers, i want to know what is true and untrue, and that will only come from analyzing the data, the information, the what, when, where and why...the who is totally irrelevant.

Everyone here is saying i wish i could talk to him, fine, what are you going to ask him?

HAS ANYONE HERE FORMULATED ANY QUESTIONS RELEVANT TO WHAT HE WROTE?

Perhaps if you formulated 10 questions, he might rear his head and answer them - what do you think about that? Of course you would actually have to THINK about what he wrote, you would actually have to INVESTIGATE the things he wrote about, and that would REQUIRE EFFORT to expended, which it seems to me none of you REALLY want to put forth.

10 questions people, is that sooo hard?

If you all care as much about the subject matter as you say you do, is that too much to ask?

><

[Justice League]

Justice might have posted alot of material but some of it was pretty damned interesting. You think that we could re establish a place for SOME of this information. I don't think that there is a Vassilatos post, course there was barely a Bill Moore post so maybe he just didn't make the cut!

grinder, I don't doubt that the material that was posted yesterday is interesting and maybe be of some value to our discussions. I just don't think that a forum venue like this is the right place to publish that kind of volume of material. I mean, we're talking like 30 different individual posts and tens of thousands of words!

What Justice should do is publish that material on his own website, and then post here excerpts that he would like to bring to our attention for discussion.

One at a time.

Like somebody else said, let us sip from the fountain, rather than stick our heads in the fire hose.

FYI, Justice's voluminous posts have NOT been deleted. They were locked first, in order to sequester them before the conversation got started, and are now moved to a hidden area of the website. I can move them back, or give you access if you want to see the stuff again, but I would prefer to see a different approach taken if we're going to visit the material.

And, apparently, you're right, there really is no specific place where the Vassilatos material has been addressed. That can also be established, starting with a link to the material on other websites. There is no need to replicate that material here, other than to cite excerpts for specific discussion.

Some may think my methods draconian, but I think they are in the best interest of effective resource management.

--PS

Some people like to walk around the pool and put there feet in first, then their knees, then there whole body.

Some just jump in and get it over with.

What's right and what's wrong? It doesn't really matter does it - its your website paul - you can and do run it however you want, otherwise it wouldn't be YOUR website right?

Its not about what's right or wrong, its just about personality differences.

We handle things differently that's all.

I am a contractor and builder by birth, by choice and by nature. I have neither the time, nor the patience, like my father to build every house perfectly, becasue there is no such thing, and he is not responsible for paying the company bills.

He is responisble for himself. I am responisble for many, many people. All he cares about is being obsessively perfect, all i care about is getting the job done and paying the bill. Between those two imposters we make a good "team," the sword and the shield. One cuts through all the bullshit, while the other protects from harm.

If you ask my father what time it is, he tells you how to build the clock. If you ask me what time it is, I will tell you time to get back to work.

Interstingly in this scenario, neither of us answered the damn question! What time is it?

I gave my reasons for posting such a vast amount of data, so quickly in the first paragraph of each post. You don't think those reasons are valid so you took action.

I jump in the water, you sample.

THis may be some academic adventure for some, and most here, it is not that way for me. I am way past academic sampling and i am sorry if that erks some of you, but I did my save the world bit, and now i have to go back to making a living and supporting my family and taking care of the people that matter the most to me, instead of trying to enlighten the masses. My time is short and constrained, so i don't really have the time that paul or some of you have to go page by page on stuff. I did that six years ago regarding the vassilatos materials. I don't have a hangup on the subject, becasue i don't need vassilatos to validate what i already know.

So paul, we have polar opposite ways of dealing with things, just like me dad and i have polar opposite personalites.

Now that we have established this, what now? How do we move forward in such a way that recognizes these differences and makes account for them?

How are you going to effectively manage THIS resource?

I mean that with most congenial sense, not to be offensive.

[twigsnapper]

Justice,

True . We all have different styles in searching for the truth of matters.

Perhaps your Fathers "obsession toward perfection" kept him alive?

quoting you here for a moment:


"This may be some academic adventure for some, and most here, it is not that way for me. I am way past academic sampling and i am sorry if that erks some of you, but I did my save the world bit, and now i have to go back to making a living and supporting my family and taking care of the people that matter the most to me, instead of trying to enlighten the masses. My time is short and constrained, so i don't really have the time that paul or some of you have to go page by page on stuff. I did that six years ago regarding the vassilatos materials. I don't have a hangup on the subject, becasue i don't need vassilatos to validate what i already know."

In some interesting turns of phrases you have done a good bit of insulting here. Did you actually mean that? Or were your fingers just going too fast? Academic adventure? way past .... sampling .... HEADLONG INTO WHAT? You did your "save the world bit" ... Oh, is that what that was? I wondered. Taking care of the people who matter .... tea and cookies for you son..... instead of enlightening the masses. Sorry but I see no "masses" here and the light you shone was not all that bright son. I understand that you don't have the time to go page by page .... and thats what Paul has been diligently doing for the past four years. I accept that you don't have the time to be thorough but don't berate him for doing proper research. What he writes finally will be built on bedrock and surely you can understand that. You investigated Vassilatos six years ago, I would think that given that lead time you would be an expert on the man.

And if you already know what you want to know why then the urge to communicate at all with others here who you know have information?

You have much to offer Justice. The object is to interact and go forward? Isn't it? twigsnapper