FOLLOW THE MONEY

A place to engage extended discussions of things that come up on the ttbrown.com website. Anything goes here, as long as it's somehow pertinent to the subject(s) at hand.
Victoria Steele
Mysterious Redhead
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FOLLOW THE MONEY

Post by Victoria Steele »

Everybody,

I just realized that this forum needs this particular "pool" to be opened. When investigating the activities of individuals and corporations and other mysterious situations one of the old sayings is " if you want to get to the core of it ..... just ...... follow the money"

So I am opening this post in hopes that any of you who have thoughts of how Dr. Brown perhaps financed his "work" might have a place to stash those thoughts where we could add to them, or draw inspiration from them.

We know that initially Dr. Brown spent something close to a quarter of a million dollars of "family" money on his research. I don't know when the last of those funds ran out. I am sure that Paul probably does.

He made an interesting reference to William Stephenson (Dr. Browns Mr. X) Paul was responding to one of us (maybe it was me, can remember thinking the question .... where did Stephenson get all his millions? .... he went from bankruptcy to a multimillionaire in just a couple of years! Boy where do I get my ticket punched for that sort of ride?)

But anyway, someone here made the comment that Stephenson had paid for the entire BSC operation in New York City (that private intelligence outfit, connected to the British government) out of "his own pocket" ..... Pauls response was sort of odd I can remember thinking. He said something like ..."Funds may have come out of his pocket ... but who was putting those funds in that pocket?" Paul help me out here ... don't remember what it was you exactly said and I can't find the quote right now, but that was the sum of it.

So WHO or WHAT was financing Brown AND the BSC. The Caroline Group?
Victoria
Mark Culpepper
The Dean
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and in exchange?

Post by Mark Culpepper »

Hi Victoria! Good post!

And I thought that too. In fact it has been sort of stuck in the back of my mind ever since these "black operations" and their activities have come into my life. (finding out that my Dad was actually part of the Jedburgh operation has been a turning point in my own life, but more of this later. Back to "following the money")

You can't do stuff without paying for it. Usually. Or you trade .... and other than the worlds oldest profession where you can resell the same item over and over <g>...... You normally have to give up something when someone pays you for it.

So what was Dr. Brown having to "give up" in exchange for some organization paying for the continuation of his basic research.

Researchers out there. Do companies just throw money at you? I don't think so, but I don't know for sure. That side of the world is strange to me.

Dr. Brown was apparently brilliant in an area that hasn't been linked to his name very much. Communications. Read the earlier Chapters that Paul already has covered . A newspaper account then said that he had set up a wireless communications between the backyard and his house! (THAT WAS IN 1917!) And it wasn't the two cans and a string that I rigged!

So the kid was already well ahead of most everybody and a group like the Caroline probably had him picked out just from those newspaper accounts. ( Those of you who are new, look up and read Chapter 6 "The Second Edison)

So here we have this kid (with a red light already blinking above his head.) I wonder how many others there were? And in reference to Pauls first book, I just wonder if that kid named Philo Farnsworth , standing in the potato field , had a red light blinking on him too? I just ask because if I was a group interested in communications development I would certainly be watching that particular kid too. Mark C
Martin Calloway
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moving

Post by Martin Calloway »

Hey guys,

While you are all wondering where the money is coming from, looking on it from the other side, I have been just noticing how much some things must have cost.

First of all, there are the moves.

Anybody move recently? Across the nation? across the street? How much did it cost you? Not even looking at the loss of attachments to a certain area, how hard was it for Linda and he family to move FIVE TIMES DURING A SINGLE SCHOOL YEAR .... FOR EVERY SCHOOL YEAR . No accountant here but thats at least 50 in ten years.

They must have travelled pretty darned light. Paul says in his chapter 29 " In Homestead the house that Townsend and Josephine were living in at the edge was small but there was a larger building on the property that Townsend was busy turning into what he liked to call his "remote lab". In a sense, all of his labs were "remote" and temporary.

Brings the question to mind .... remote from what? Is that because he was out in the everglades .... or .... remote .... as in .... separate from the "Mother lab?" Hwo long did the Browns stay there? Linda had stopped counting the moves by then but it doesn't look like her parents slowed up at all. And all those moves COST. Martin
Martin Calloway
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remote places

Post by Martin Calloway »

Anybody done a total count of the places that Townsend Brown has lived? Paul? Is there such a list? Can you give us even a hint. I know from what his daughter said about the moves...... they were on the move constantly. Did Josephine KNOW she was marrying into this sort of situation? Surely she knew? Martin
Victoria Steele
Mysterious Redhead
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grey traveling suit

Post by Victoria Steele »

Hi everyone,

I want to share this with you all. I found it romantic and lovely and I think that it answers the questions that you all have about Josephine and whether or not she knew what was in store for her.

Join me in Chapter 18 (Wagner in the Trees)

And I smile because I KNOW THAT SHE KNEW.

"The bride was attired in a simple grey TRAVELING FROCK. with a little grey hat and shoes and hose to match" .......

SHE KNEW. THE BRIDE CAN CHOOSE EXACTLY THE TEMPER OF HER CEREMONY. ITS HER DAY! AND JOSEPHINE CHOSE A "TRAVELING SUIT" SHE KNEW!

She probably wanted to get the heck out of that small Ohio town ... I just wonder if she realized how far OUT she was going to get!!!!! Victoria
Paul S.
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Re: remote places

Post by Paul S. »

Martin Calloway wrote:Anybody done a total count of the places that Townsend Brown has lived? Paul?
No, I'm sorry to say I don't have an accurate count - yet.

There were quite a few moves in the mid-to-late 70s, before he he settled on Catalina for the final few years. It's a very difficult itinerary to follow, to put it mildly.
Is there such a list? Can you give us even a hint. I know from what his daughter said about the moves...... they were on the move constantly.
When we first started corresponding, Linda Brown told me that in the course of her primary and secondary academic career, she attended 48 differrent schools. That's about as good an indication as we have presently of the extent of their travels.

When I started this project, I thought it would be interesting to follow the Brown family's travels across the country with a map. Might still do that one of these days. Hopefully, by the time we're done, we'll have a accurate account of the itinerary and all the stops.
Did Josephine KNOW she was marrying into this sort of situation? Surely she knew?
That's hard to say. On one level, we know that the truth of their lives didn't really begin to form until, let's say, when TTB joined the Navy in 1930. With that in mind it might be safe to say that neither of them knew what was in store.

But on another level -- that mystical "how did he know what he knew?" level (the real reason we're ALL here...) -- it's equally likely that "they knew" generally, if not specifically, what was in store for them. In that light, I think it's safe to say that TTB and Jo chose each other because they both knew they were up for the journey.

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Paul S.
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Re: FOLLOW THE MONEY

Post by Paul S. »

Sorry, Victoria, to be a little slow getting around to this one...
Victoria Steele wrote: I just realized that this forum needs this particular "pool" to be opened. When investigating the activities of individuals and corporations and other mysterious situations one of the old sayings is " if you want to get to the core of it ..... just ...... follow the money"
That's true, provided you've got a good trail to follow. My recollection is that the first (most recent?) famous use of the line "Follow The Money" was in the movie "All The President's Men." I also recall (don't quote me on this) the screen writer William Goldman saying that the line was not in the book -- he made it up for the movie. So who knows where the expression was first used...?

In any event, Woodward and Berstein were following at the very worst a warm trail. And there were records. Not always easy to find records, but records that were accessible and witnesses that were still quite alive.

Would that that were the case here.
So I am opening this post in hopes that any of you who have thoughts of how Dr. Brown perhaps financed his "work" might have a place to stash those thoughts where we could add to them, or draw inspiration from them.
In this post in another thread:

viewtopic.php?p=1262#1262

...Martin Calloway commented that while they were living at Ashlawn, the Brown's seemed to live "without regard to the cost." It's not much a clue, but that seems to imply at least that when they needed money to live a certain way, the resources were there. Where exactly the resources came from, well, we may never find out for sure, but hopefully there's at least a hint in Chapter 34: The Caroline Group.
We know that initially Dr. Brown spent something close to a quarter of a million dollars of "family" money on his research. I don't know when the last of those funds ran out. I am sure that Paul probably does.
What source are you citing there, Victoria? I've heard similar numbers, but I'm dubious as to their reliability (one way or the other).

someone here made the comment that Stephenson had paid for the entire BSC operation in New York City (that private intelligence outfit, connected to the British government) out of "his own pocket" ..... Pauls response was sort of odd I can remember thinking. He said something like ..."Funds may have come out of his pocket ... but who was putting those funds in that pocket?" Paul help me out here ... don't remember what it was you exactly said and I can't find the quote right now, but that was the sum of it.
Yeah, that's pretty much what I said. There is a story about that. I just haven't gotten to it yet.
So WHO or WHAT was financing Brown AND the BSC. The Caroline Group?
Looks to me like you just answered your own question, Victoria. But it's going to be difficult if not downright impossible to follow THAT trail.

--PS
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Victoria Steele
Mysterious Redhead
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Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 7:06 am

quarter of a million

Post by Victoria Steele »

Paul,

I am embarrassed to say that I don't remember exactly where I got that quarter of a million dollar figure regarding what Dr. Brown had spent on his work. Maybe someone else out there has read that more recently than I have. I remember the amount because it was such a nice round number! and I can remember thinking how much money that must have been then. When I find the exact quote I'll get back to you on that (anyone who happens to know, please wade in here and spare me some time) I am almost positive that it was Moore? or a source quoting Moore. And you are right, perhaps I should consider the source more carefully before accepting the information!

Paul ...... Mark C. makes an interesting comment about these promising individuals having a "red light all over their heads? put there by the Caroline Group. Whats your take on that Paul? Do you think that is how this "Group" worked .... reaching out for people they could develop in secrecy? But surely not all could be drawn into a life of such secrecy!

And Josephine and Townsend. Shoot. They were keeping secrets in their home town and I'll just bet that they enjoyed that so maybe that was a profile that helped them BOTH pass. Maybe she had to pass the test too? Maybe the Caroline group realized at some point that he was the sort who could not go on alone.

My mind racing now ..... and if that is the case ... what happened then between Morgan and Linda? Damn. Victoria
Paul S.
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A List of The Places

Post by Paul S. »

Martin Calloway wrote:Anybody done a total count of the places that Townsend Brown has lived? Paul? Is there such a list?
Well....whaddya know....

I was just rummaging through some of my e-mail correspondence (I've been doing a lot of that this week) and I just found a message from Linda Brown that includes a nearly complete recount of Townsend Brown's Litany of Domiciles.

So here, at the risk of making you all weary just by reading it, is Linda's best recollection of the places her family lived over the years. This is not a complete list nor is it in perfect chronological order, but it's as good a reference as we have at the moment:

ZANESVILLE
GREEN COVE SPRINGS
HAWTHORNE CLUB, ZANESVILLE. OHIO
WASHINGTON, D.C.
LAUREL CANYON, CALIFORNIA
LAGUNA BEACH, CALIFORNIA
KAUAI
HONOLULU 1951-52
LOS ANGELES, CALIFORNIA 1952.
CLEVELAND,OHIO 1952
WASHINGTON, D, C. 1952 (visiting Grandparents. I went to local school for one month!)
ZANESVILLE, OHIO (SHARONGATE) 1952
WASHINGTON DC.
LEESBURG, VIRGINIA (CORNWALL HOUSE)
LEESBURG, VIRGINIA (GRANADAS HOUSE)
LEESBURG, VIRGINIA (MONTRESSOR RIDING CAMP AND SCHOOL)
UMATILLA, FLORIDA (HOUSE IN TOWN)....1957
UMATILLA, FLORIDA (HOUSE ON LAKE).... 1957 into 1958
WALKERTOWN, NORTH CAROLINA 1958
LEESBURG, VIRGINIA (LEE HOUSE ON WIRT ST) 1958 into 1959
ALEXANDRIA (HUNTING TOWERS APTS ) summer of 1959 - fall 1960
BETHESDA, MARYLANDfall of 1960 to following summer.....
MEADVILLE, PA - summer 1961 thru Jan 1962
NASSAU 1962
HARBOR ISLAND.1962
EUSTICE, FLORIDA 1962
ROCKVILLE, MARYLAND..1962
PAOLI, PA 1962
MALVERN, PA (ASHLAWN) 1963 -- 1965
HOMESTEAD, FLORIDAfall of 1965.
PHILADELPHIA ( DRAKE HOTEL).
PHILADELPHIA, PA...TOWNHOUSE ON LOMBARD
SANTA MONICA...EMBASSY HOTEL 1967
PACIFIC PALISADES,CALIFORNIA 1968
RANCHO MIRAGE, CALIFORNIA....1969
SAN FRANCISCO, CALIFORNIA....
CATALINA ISLAND April 1971
CATALINA ISLAND.COUNTRY CLUB APARTMENTS 1972-
SUNNYVALE, CALIFORNIA
CHAPEL HILL, NORTH CAROLINA
TAMPA FLORIDA
BREA, CALIFORNIA(soon as I can lock into some dates
CORONADO,SAN Diego...Cal....
CATALINA.....til 1985 for Dad.......1987 for mom....
Paul Schatzkin
aka "The Perfesser"
"At some point we have to deal with the facts, not what we want to believe is true." -- Jack Bauer
Victoria Steele
Mysterious Redhead
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Joined: Mon Feb 20, 2006 7:06 am

all those moves!

Post by Victoria Steele »

I had no idea.

Everytime Townsend Browns name has ever been mentioned , the states linked to him have been.... Ohio ..... and maybe California ..... and I think that Vassilatos mentioned a place he called Umatillo Florida (where he said Dr. Brown had spent the last years of his life! Goes to show how much he DIDN'T KNOW ....... I counted twenty-six moves after UmatillA.) Holy Cow.

This is the scarier part Paul. You are on ,what? Chapter 34? And Josephine and Townsend have made it, by Lindas List, to Hawthorne Farm? Thats where they were married, right? and had their honeymoon? Now its about 1933 ... What happens next? The list says Washington, (I assume D.C.)

And following the Linda and Morgan storyline you have covered Ashlawn in 1964 and have just gotten into Homestead, right? All of that has been just fascinating ,

but Oh my God, how are you ever going to catch up with all this man was into ...... just from the moves!

You said somewhere that you have been working on this book for about four years. Is that right? I am astounded by the story that is still out there. Just going by the locations not mentioned yet . Nassau? Kauai?..... I knew about Catalina, but I have gotten the impression from Paul and Neenie and Pat too that perhaps Dr. Brown had something else on his mind besides making fogless mirrors. Just WHAT I hope you will be able to tell us eventually. You said that you didn't expect the scope of it all and I can believe you now.

And we have Mr. Twigsnappers wonderful account of his experiences with Dr. Brown in Paris and outside London AND THAT ISN'T EVEN MENTIONED IN THE "MOVES LIST"

And look how the moves were generally big ones. From Laguna Beach California to ..... Kaui ...... what prompted that? From California suddenly BACK to North Carolina, where he was in the fifties .... and then to Florida and again to California? There has to be some sort of pattern here? Is there?

This has been a full time deal for you, am I right? No wonder you needed to take a vacation! I noted that Elizabeth was still sort of "Manning the phones" .... so ... where is she going on HER vacation? Living vicariously here!

But here I am again! Knock knock!!!! The resident pain in the ass Paul.
ITS BEEN A LONG TIME. Whats going to happen next?

Victoria
Martin Calloway
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following money

Post by Martin Calloway »

I don't know who ever it was that THINKS he first used that expression but I can almost guarnatee you that any investigative group would have used that phrase. "Follow the money, check the banks, watch the tax returns ..." sounds like early FBI to me .... How a person spends his money, where he makes his money ... well, you all know, it sets up a pretty accurate profile on a person. So "follow the money" is pretty darned good advice, no matter who said it first.

But I doubt that anyone in Townsend Browns hidden circle is going to be that stupid, to leave a money trail. And I think as proof of that Paul, just try to find out where the man did his banking. If he bought a car, did he finance it? Or pay cash? Did he own homes? Own stocks? Bonds? ... did he have any kind of retirement plan with any corporation? In fact, can you prove at all that the man worked anywhere at all? The more holes you find, the more sure that you can be that he was into something dark.

I know that right now you are into his Navy career. But when he leaves the navy, where is the money coming from? Was it Victoria who said that he had spent some $250,000 of his own family money to keep his project alive? But what happened when that ran out?

He was moving constantly. That takes money! Trips to islands here and there costs. And it has to come from somewhere. So how did he explain himself to the IRS? Anybody know? When he died, was there any estate left to his daughter? any monies left for his wife?

If so, where did that come from? See there is alot that you can learn about a person by digging around in the money that they have made or spent. Martin
Martin Calloway
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just TRY to follow the money

Post by Martin Calloway »

This is slightly off the subject but maybe not. When people want money to dissapear right under the taxpayer nose .... there are ways. Just look at this account of the Police college expenses in Iragq. We paid this out. Where'd it go?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060928/ts_ ... uilding_dc

Read all of it. Its gross. Its disgusting.

But even worse than the crap dripping from the ceilings is this

In late 2003, Congress allocated $18.4 billion to rebuild Iraq and immediately handed out giant contracts to a small number of big U.S. construction companies, drawing criticism for not giving work directly to Iraqi firms.

The State Department's senior advisor on Iraq, David Satterfield, said the U.S. government had learned from its mistakes and was adapting programs, now handing out more work to Iraqi firms.

The nonpartisan Government Accountability Office issued a report this week and said the Pentagon's own auditors had questioned $3.5 billion in unsupported charges for Iraqi reconstruction projects.

"When we break down this amount, it averages $2.7 million in overcharges each day we've been in Iraq. That's amazing," said Waxman, one of the Democratic Party's most vocal critics of Iraq rebuilding programs

So somebody want to tell me where THAT money actually went?

People ask why we are there? Sorry to be on a bandstand. Couldn't resist it. I thought that this would be right up your road Paul. Martin
Trickfox
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Two words about black projects

Post by Trickfox »

IRAN CONTRA
The psychopropulsier (as pointed out in the book The Good-bye man by Linda Brown and Jan Lofton) is a Quantum entanglement project under development using Quantum Junctions. Join us at http://www.Peeteelab.com
Martin Calloway
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cash?

Post by Martin Calloway »

Laughing Trickfox and you are absolutely on the right track. What amazes me is the amount of money and yet, I'll bet Mark C. could tell you too, sinde he is a teacher. the amount we spend on our own school children is pitiful.

Saw a bumper sticker that was appropriate. something like .... Let the military hold bake sales for their bombers, get the money to the schools.

Hey, don't yell at me. I know that the military investment is important. But when I see it wasted, or intentionally diverted. Thats worth squawking about.

Didn't mean to get off the TTBrown story ...... lets see ..... follow the money.

So, does Linda Brown remember what kind of accounts her Dad had? Did he bank with Bank of America while he was in California or something like that. Did he use credit cards? Does she remember anything about how the families bills were being paid or know where some of the money might have come from?

The green Cadillac for example. When he bought that, did he finance it?

And did they ever own a home? Though something tells me that owning a home would have been on the impossible side. First of all they were never there long enough to even put it on the market so they could move.

I think that if Paul looks carefully at all of the places that Townsend Brown lived he might see some sort of a pattern. Maybe. I mean. There has to be some sort of a tip in why all the moves. At least once a year. You might as well not even unpack but apparently Josephine did.

How do you tell a young teen that you are moving again after she just made friends? I just wonder. Martin
Chris Knight
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Post by Chris Knight »

Victoria,

I was digging through my docs so I can be somewhat coherent in November. You were asking about family money spent by Townsend on his research. According to his notes of June 30, 1985, he estimated he had spent approximately $500,000 of his own money over the previous 60 years.

Andrew
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