The Spiritual Implications of Time Travel, Etc.

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Andrew .... I love that word .... have never seen it before .... but it just sound right.

Someone once said (paraphrasing here and I think this came from William Moore) That "whatever force was out there .... it had the ability to control our perception of it."

Now that makes perfect sense. Whether that other intelligence is from "way out there" ..... or the "next onion skin inward" ...... the fact is that it would make sense that it could control our brain functions .. alter our conciousness.

You know in the sixties there were kids following Timothy Leary around. And it wasn't just kids .... from what I understand the CIA and alot of other agencies were running detailed conciousness studies. And you KNOW one of the things at the top of their list would have been "control of the subject" If some hippy on Haight could manage that can you imagine what kind of drugs an advanced intelligence might have at its disposal?

And then, dropping back to the Bible. What was that "pillar of cloud" that lead the people out in the desert for forty years .... Were they "seeing" what they thought they were seeing? Or was that "manna" that showed up mysteriously .... laced with something? Elizabeth

[Paul S.]

Just so's y'all don't think I'm not taking this thread seriously, I thought I'd toss this in:

This weekend's NPR program "Speaking of Faith" is featuring a segment entitled "Quarks & Creation," described as follows:

"Science and religion are often pitted against one another; but how do they complement, rather than contradict, one another? We learn how one man applies the deepest insights of modern physics to think about how the world fundamentally works, and how the universe might make space for prayer."

FYI, this is the same theme His Holiness the Dalai Lama discusses in his recent book "The Universe in a Single Atom," which is also worth spending some time with.

The program is available in a variety of formats from this URL

http://speakingoffaith.publicradio.org/ ... ndex.shtml

I will probably download the Podcast version and listen to it on my iPod when I'm in the car during this coming week. I'll letchy'all know if I find anything interesting enough to bring up here.

--PS

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Paul,

maybe we could move this entire post to the other category since it has expanded way beyond a simple discussion of that particular chapter .... and its easier to just follow along from one chapter to the next in this particular discussion area.

Maybe "Time/ Space travel Implications" ???????

and in that area maybe we could even have a separate area for "Little Green Men" Ohhh.... that could be FUN. Elizabeth

[Paul S.]

Since this thread is really not directly related to the book and chapters as they come online, I've taken the liberty of moving the thread to a spot under the generic "Extended Website Discussion" heading.

If Dr. Jordan wants to, he can chahge the "subect" header of his original post, and that will change the name of the thread. I'm OK with this thread title under this area of the forum, though.

I trust everybody who wants to will be able to find this thread here.

--PS

[Trickfox]

What was that "pillar of cloud" that lead the people out in the desert for forty years .... Were they "seeing" what they thought they were seeing? Or was that "manna" that showed up mysteriously .... laced with something? Elizabeth

The answer is: That pillar of cloud was probably marijuana smoke. Yes they were seeing it but only in some sort of time hiccup. Time slows to a stop when it gets very interesting.

At some point in time you stop all of sudden and you say to yourself, "what a great day".

That's the way the trickfox feels anyway these days.

I think I will change for the better today.
I will stop doing what I should not do....
and I will start doing what I should, .....
and all of time will reset in an "INTERVAL" of time............... (Period).

[Dr. Jordan]

Everybody and Dr. Jordan in particular.

Why was it that with the wondrous title of Time travel .... we are suddenly plunged into a discussion of Good and Evil/ God or Satan .... and I am sure that the "ultimate battle" was just a breath away? Right?

Victoria, you are quite right to ask why we suddenly plunged down a more introspective path; you agree that while we live in this world and travel in TIME, we only travel in one direction, but God (and hence other spirtiual beings) are not contstrained by the single dimension.

I just want to know why that is?

why what is, the ultimate battle? Yes, I believe that it is close.

Why do we have to go immediately to what God did, as translated in the Bible. I hafta tell you ... you have a hard nut with me ... all I smell when I get a whiff of that is .... death and destruction. And I was hoping thats not what we were talking about here.

Oh No Victoria, quite the contrary. I don't think of death and destruction when I think of the Bible. I think of all the wonderful things that Jesus did when he walked the earth; I think of all the wonderful promises that were fulfilled over the centuries, and promises yet to be fulfilled in the future. I think the possibilities (for good) with Time Travel are endless~

You have mentioned a lot of things in this posting, which will take a while to respond back. But I do want ot point out a website that gives a Biblical view of the Nephilim (from the Old Testament) and answers some of the more than pertinent questions:
What is behind the UFOs?
Are they real?
What does the Bible say about them?
What is their agenda for Planet Earth?
http://www.khouse.org/6640/BP052/

Now, I understand that many of you will disagree withme, and that's fine. I am not intent on preaching here. That's not my goal. I think Paul has written a fine book, but there are issues that have been raised with the technology that Dr. Brown and his colleagues had discovered; unfortunately, there will always be fringe people who will use the information regarding the research to their own gain. Unidentified Flying Objects do not necessarily mean that someone from another part of the universe visited our galaxy; but to these people, that is all that it will mean.

Later,

[Trickfox]

Now, I understand that many of you will disagree withme, and that's fine. there are issues that have been raised with the technology that Dr. Brown and his colleagues had discovered;

unfortunately, there will always be fringe people who will use the information regarding the research to their own gain.

Unidentified Flying Objects do not necessarily mean that someone from another part of the universe visited our galaxy; but to these people, that is all that it will mean.
Later,

welcome again Dr. Jordan.

These three observations appear to be worth plenty of coments. I will let others comment on parts of it.

As for us agreeing with you or not about the agenda behind the return of the Nephilim, I suppose that personnal speaking, I would like to read the rest of Dr. Missler's book to come to any specific conclusion, but I will try to do that and let you know.

All I know is it has a historically significant viewpoint in scripture. Are you sure there any conflicting writtings in Egyptology to indicate other agendas by the Nephilim? Is there even one other type of record confirming this?

Trickfox

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Trickfox.

The ancient Egyptians wrote of the origins of their writing ...... crediting the original teacher A being named "Seshat" .... she was what they called the "Goddess of Writing" and she is easy to spot on the walls of various temples because she has a long quil type pen poised in her hand. She apparently invented writing and her companion THOTH then taught it to humanity. teamwork.

Trivia lodged in my brain on my part but probably worth looking into for someone. I am sure there is an entire story there. Elizabeth

[twigsnapper]

Dr. Jordan and all,

Regarding those who consider that UFOs "MUST" come from "outer space."

Even the way I phrased that comes from the age where the general public " learned" about beings from "outer space"(forties, fifties) It seemed such a fantastic thought then but was so soundly incorporated in the language and the life of the times! I think of alot of things when I think of the fifties. "Flying Saucers" and the "atomic bomb" are just two of them. The public was fed a lot of horseshit regarding both of them.

Regarding the atomic bomb, "Duck and Cover" was one of the manure piles! Those of you with some age on you will recognize now how ridiculous that all was! (As if a desk was going to protect you! ) Those of you who are too young to know what that phrase refers to, perhaps you should just know that you are very fortunate.

The things said about "flying saucers" was entirely another pile dumped out there. No serious look at that phenomenon was encouraged. In fact, if you ever happened to see something,(and were brave enough to mention it in the press or to your neighbors), you were AUTOMATICALLY dubbed a crackpot. And as advanced as we THINK we have become,that attitude lingers.

And of course behind the public attitude of something there generally lurks an agenda. Downplaying the seriousness of an atomic blast? The agenda was to do several things. Calm the children, while scaring the bejeezus out of the adults, selling the " red threat "for the current political climate. Just two of the agendas at work..

Flying Saucers presented a problem of keeping the general populace calm and maintaining control in an uncertain age. By dismissing the whole situation as "rubbish spewing from the lunatic fringe" was quite a bit easier than actually explaining them. Or even LOOKING for a true explanation. a perfect example of EYES WIDE SHUT.

In both cases. Eventually those being disinformed become informed. EYES THAT WERE ONCE WIDE SHUT WILL BECOME WIDE OPEN. And then its a whole new situation, and a whole new age. Twigsnapper

[Chris Knight]

Since this is sort of a time travel line of thought, I was up late last night and caught Frequency with Dennis Quaid. It's one of my favorites.

In the movie, only the son and father are aware of changes being made as they commnicate through a ham radio over a period of 30 years.

One theory I remember is that only the person traveling through time would be aware of any changes. Now, if that person were able to make changes that affected his/her own future, would that person be "split off" as a separate person upon returning to the original time of departure leading to the existence of two of the same person, such as in Back to the Future Part II, or would the history adjust itself so that no change in the future would utimately occur. This assumes one can make a change in the past. I know this was being discussed on another line, but I don't quite rememeber where right now.

Andrew

[The Grey Man]

I guess I'll jump in here...

I have always had a personal fascination with time-travel literature, which for the most part seems to have started with HG Wells "The Time Machine" -- which was published in 1895!

What prompts me to come out of the shadows to post here is the reference to Back to the Future II - the one with the "alternate time line" where "Biff" pretty much rules the world.

Considering how much technology has been suppressed in the century since Wells first published, does anybody besides me wonder if this "reality" we're living in is, in fact, the alternate time line? That maybe we're not supposed to be living like this at all?

If that's the case, then, how do we bet back into the timeline we're supposed to be living in. I wonder if Dr. Brown had a clue...??

Grey

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Welcome Grey! I was wondering when you were going to join us! .....

I believe that Dr. Brown knew alot about the possibilities of alternate paths. I will leave it to Paul to tell what he has learned and his story is an unfolding journey. And you have quite a sympathetic soul in Paul ... the "Back to the Future" story has held a fascination for him too. Ask him what object d'art he has in his den, straight from that movie. (and unfortuneately, his return will be delayed because he is going to Utah to attend the funeral of Mrs. Farnsworth early in May) ......


You know there are many who refer to Dr. Brown (and others like him) as being "ahead of their time." But consider this. Perhaps THEY are the PROPER TIME LINE. Its all of us who are "Behind the time". And the way to correct that? I think Dr. Brown would suggest that it would be important to allow others the opportunity to "step up" to the proper time line. I believe that is what is happening with the writing of this book.

I have heard that some Native American tribes have a tradition of knot tying as they are repeating an important story. Stories are told over and over and each time that story is told a knot is tied .... as the generations pass the knots are passed on also as sort of a "marker" which represents the history of that story and its interaction with those who have heard it. This project that Paul is involved in right now is sort of like that. Its a grand and wondrous "knot"

Through his words that knot will be tied. Those who touch that knot later will have a connection with the truth and with history and the knowledge will be carried on. When that happens those who touch the knot .... get closer and closer to those who have tied it. And soon they are on the same level as those who were able to tell the story.

Did I just make any sense to you just then? I sure hope so! If not, its not your fault for not understanding but mine in not being able to express myself.

Welcome again Grey Man. Your thoughts and opinions are welcomed and appreciated. Someday I will explain how I knew you would join us .... but thats a whole second strange story. Elizabeth

[twigsnapper]

Well, plenty of "fare wells" but not in the sense that everyone has seemed to take it. I just got a little busy. Sorry to cause concern.

And I have been casting over what all you gracious people have said since this group of messages was posted. I encourage all of you to stop for a moment and look again at what was written here. Again the points apply. So I am reopening this section.

Dr. Jordan, are you still out there with us? A current comment?

twigsnapper

[Mikado14]

Well, plenty of "fare wells" but not in the sense that everyone has seemed to take it. I just got a little busy. Sorry to cause concern.

And I have been casting over what all you gracious people have said since this group of messages was posted. I encourage all of you to stop for a moment and look again at what was written here. Again the points apply. So I am reopening this section.

Dr. Jordan, are you still out there with us? A current comment?

twigsnapper

I am extremely glad to see you are still among the living. (excuse my sarcasm) Well I have forgotten whose move it is so may I make one?

Oh hell, here goes, if I'm out of turn, you can have two.

This is the first that I have seen this post, as I have said previously, there is just so much to read in all of the forum.

A few questions to ponder:

Is there one objective man or woman out there that can piece this post into one?

Why do some insist on having Jesus in everything?

Why do some insist on UFO's being from outer space?

Why do some want to convert me to Jesus as the answer?

Why do some want to inflict fear into me from aliens?

Why can't I see the forest for those trees?

and last...

Why can't some look at anything with an OBJECTIVE mind and not instill an agenda into it?

Mikado

I will post my views later.

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Seems to me that we all should realize that EVERYONE has an agenda. EVERYONE. Look closely at yourself if you find your response to be "oh, but not me!" because if you are truthful with yourself you will find an agenda also. Maybe our agendas are like Dr. Browns "aether". You never really notice them because you are IN them so completely. They saturate your daily life. I like that word "saturate" by the way .... and I meant to use it because with his "interactive force" I have concluded that this is not something that we are just swimming in and apart from ... this is something that is "saturated" through our every cell. Of course thats just my current thinking. (no, I did not mean that as a pun, but ... not bad. huh? forgive me.)

All your questions are more than valid Mikado. They are vital.

Is there one objective man or woman out there? My considered answer? "No, not really. But there are plenty who are willing to recognize and deal with their own agendas and go from there."

Why do some insist on having Jesus in everything? We don't have the time it would take to answer that. But its a grand question. Why the need?

Why the insistance that UFOs are from space? Maybe, (my thought) we come to easy conclusions. If we don't see it here, then it must be from there! Morgan has warned Paul and me about going into the either/or trap. The answer of "outer space" is so easy. No one ever stops to wonder WHY we don't "see it here".

Why do some want to convert me to Jesus as the answer? " Because they want your company. Good followup question to that is " Why do they want your company?" Why also is it so important to feel that that solution is the only answer?

Why do some want to inflict fear in me of Aliens? Again, my opinion .... "they are afraid and they don't want to be there by themselves. or there is a reason they want YOU to be afraid ..... or .... how many agendas can YOU come up with?

I can easily see that the military had reasons for looking toward space for the threat. How could they investigate the possibility that there was something operating under their noses here on earth without them knowing about it? Another earth bound technology NOT UNDER THEIR CONTROL? Now there is a terrifying prospect for a military mind! And they are in power because of their ability to keep the American public safe from foriegn threats? Best thing to do is say " well, nothing out there exists really ! All of you are nuts, but if there WAS something darting about in our skies. it would have to be something from another world. And apparently it means us no harm. (If that reasoning sounds ridiculous just read what the military actually said during the fifties. Thats just about it.)

"Why can't I see the forest for the trees" Maybe the forest doesn't want to share everything with you? Maybe we NEED to see the obvious before we get wise enough to see the hidden? Maybe our wits need to be sharper.

Its like banging on a mental door yelling," let me in! let me in!" .... There is a certain security in knowing that there is a door there and we can bang on it and everything is so familiar and its not our responsibility really, right? If the door is locked and we are not given access. We know where we are in our world, right? Then suddenly and for unexplained reasons the door swings open? What then brave door bangers? Elizabeth