TOWNSEND BROWN AND THE MEDIA

[Mark Culpepper]

Great music Trickfox ... thanks so much for it! Buffetts the man! Mark C.

[Victoria Steele]

Trickfox! Thanks from me too.
We must all have "coastal confessions " to share!
Margaritaville, Friday night after the conference ... Las Vegas! I'll buy the first round of drinks to those of you here who want to toast to Dr. Brown! (after that you are on your own!) I don't drink myself but I am sure that they can fix me a fancy fruitfilled soda! We will toast to a great sun-filled life filled with Islands, Palm Trees, blue waters, seaplanes! Thanks for the music Trickfox. That was very thoughtful of you! Victoria

[Paul S.]

Paul,

Angela, you seem to be addressing this post to me, so I guess I should answer except that... I really don't have one for you...<g>

I am interested in HOW and WHY William Moore decided to include that previous article about Townsend Brown in his book about the Philadelphia Experiment. He leaves the inference that Brown was totally involved in the project but others have said that Brown never admitted anything of that sort.

I'm with you there, Angela, I'd love to hear the answer to that question. But that would have to come from Mr. Moore. I haven't got a clue myself.

But Victoria is right. Why should I even bother to ask that question when the only one that can answer it is Moore himself and he doesn't seem at all interested in doing that.

Exactly. There seems to be a presumption that Mr. Moore is avoiding this space, refusing to step and and speak for himself, but it seems to me there is at least an equal likelihood that he doesn't even know we're here, asking these things of him.

I'm not condemning or defending, I just think we oughta know a few more things before we judge.

So .... why are you asking .... does it have anything to do with pens of a different color? Those around me know that I have certain "abilities" ... they aren't crayons .... but the colors on the paper are different and they are yours. Right?

Are you talking to me there, Angela? If you are, sorry, but I'm not following you. I do all my writing these days strictly with keyboard-and-screen. The "crayons" reference lost me.

--PS

[Paul S.]

We've discussed the Philly Exp. (PE) in other areas - Nick Cook for example. When he came across the PE associated with Brown...

Can we please all agree on our acronyms here?

From now on, "The Philadelphia Experiment" = "TPX."

Because I can, I have gone back and edited all references like "the PE" to "TPX."

Doth sayeth the webmaster.

Thanks,

--PS

[Paul S.]

T.Towsend Brown's work appears to have been the seed to a whole new area of science that very few people were aware of except people like Dr. Einstein, and Dr. Edward Teller, and of course Dr, Oppenheimer.

I feel it is absolutely necessary to isolate and highlight that portion of Trickfox's post here, because that, my friends is THE POINT.

Trickfox is not the only one who has expressed such sentiments. I have a great deal of respect for a researcher named Tom Bearden, who has done a lot of research on subjects very similar to what we're talking about here, and indeed might be the world's foremost authority on "Energy from the Vacuum."

So I think it's important to sit up and take notice when somebody like Bearden says -- as Trickfox is also saying -- that there is something missing from the basic "Maxwellian" electro-magnetic theory that has dominated electrical science for more than 100 years now.

Maybe that "something missing" is embodied in some of Tesla's work, maybe it's embodied in some of Brown's work. And I, for one, do not pretend to be enough of an electrical scientist to be able to tell anybody succinctly just what that "missing ingredient" might be. Maybe it's like Einstein said and Brown supposedly proved, that there really is a natural connection between electricity and gravity.

I don't know, I'm just a story teller, and I hope that by the time I get to the point where I need to, I'll understand better.

In the meantime, y'all stand up and salute what Trickfox says. That's why we're here.

Tom Bearden's website: http://www.cheniere.org/

--PS

[Victoria Steele]

IT SPEAKS! IT MUST HAVE FINISHED ITS LAST CHAPTER . HOORAY!

And I agree with you Paul and Trickfox . There is something VERY important hiding in the story of Townsend Brown. Whatever it is .... we will all recognize it when we see it because .... well, just because. Not able to explain that precisely .... but that is the feeling that I have and I believe in it.

You said something pretty thought provoking .... You said "What Einstein theorized and Perhaps Townsend Brown proved ......"THERE REALLY IS A NATURAL CONNECTION BETWEEN ELECTRICITY AND GRAVITY."

Something that Townsend Brown apparently knew in the early twenties. Much to talk about regarding HOW an individual is privy to information that advanced........ but thats missing the most important point here.

IF YOU CAN CHANGE GRAVITY ..... YOU CAN ALTER TIME ..... IF HE DID IT ..... IF DR. BROWN PROVED SOMEHOW THAT HE COULD DO THAT .... THEN THE FOLKS IN CHARGE OF HIS DEVELOPMENTS ..... CAN , ACCORDING TO EINSTEIN HIMSELF ..... ALTER TIME.

Chew on that folks. It may SEEM fantastic .... but I have the nagging hunch that its only because we don't understand yet. Victoria

[Mark Culpepper]

This is a response to Paul. We were talking about "secret developments" and he seemed to make quite a distinction between what he felt was "classified material" and what could rightfully be called "secret". And I think he intended to get back to the discussion but then other things happened and he hasn't been back .... so I am bringing it up again Paul cause I'd like to know what you were driving at.

I think I know where you are going though. Things that our military is USING right now but that the normal man on the street doesn't know about ..... Thats CLASSIFIED" BUT SOMETHING SECRET ..... oH, I GET IT! DAH.......... IF they DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT, They CAN'T CLASSIFY IT? IS THAT WHAT YOU ARE SAYING?

Lemme think on that for a second. a spy plane working for the airforce is "classified" information. But something developed PRIVATELY .... WITHOUT THE MILITARY SUPPORT AND COMMAND ..... then .... that would be Secret? Is that where you are going Paul? I sense that you have a reason to make that distinction so I would really like to hear whats on your mind in that direction.

BUT DON'T TAKE YOUR ATTENTION away from your next chapter! You know, theres VICTORIA. (HEY,did you catch the round of drinks offered at Margarittaville in Vegas in November. huh. Might be worth the trip just to be able to lift a glass to Dr. Brown!) Mark C.

[Paul S.]

I think I know where you are going though. Things that our military is USING right now but that the normal man on the street doesn't know about ..... Thats CLASSIFIED" BUT SOMETHING SECRET ..... oH, I GET IT! DAH.......... IF they DON'T KNOW ABOUT IT, They CAN'T CLASSIFY IT? IS THAT WHAT YOU ARE SAYING?

You catch on quick, Mark.

Lemme think on that for a second. a spy plane working for the airforce is "classified" information. But something developed PRIVATELY .... WITHOUT THE MILITARY SUPPORT AND COMMAND ..... then .... that would be Secret?

Clearly, you don't need me to draw a picture.

Is that where you are going Paul? I sense that you have a reason to make that distinction so I would really like to hear whats on your mind in that direction.

As lay-persons, every day men and women on the street, the distinction is almost immaterial. Either way, "secret," or "classified," we're not gonna know about it.

But if... and that's a mighty big if... IF we're dealing with, say, a "deeper draft vessell," something that is even more hidden than classified military operatons, then that does raise the possibility, however unprovable, that there might be things out there -- or right near here -- that are even more "secret" than anything the military might have "classified."

I think that's where I was going with that. Check with me again in the morning.

BUT DON'T TAKE YOUR ATTENTION away from your next chapter! You know, theres VICTORIA. (HEY,did you catch the round of drinks offered at Margarittaville in Vegas in November. huh. Might be worth the trip just to be able to lift a glass to Dr. Brown!)

Make mine a "virgin" Margarita... no alchohol --not a drop has passed these lips for coming on 19 years now -- and I wouldn't miss it for the world.

--PS

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

Hi Victoria!

Ah! love Buffetts music but hate the booze .... believe it or not .... just hate the taste of it. But I am a wild Pepsi drinker! Saving my energies you know! Looking forward to the meeting in November. And raising a glass of whatever to Dr. Brown is going to be a special moment. ( He would have been joining us in the soft drink department .... even wine gave him a headache, according to his family!) Looking forward to meeting all those here who can join us.

For those who don't know yet .... the meeting we are mentioning is going to be in Las Vegas in mid November . There is a convention which is being held and our Paul is going to be one of the speakers ..... talking about his upcoming book and the life and times of Thomas Townsend Brown.

I was thinking the other day how actually sad it will be when this project is over and the book is finished and on shelves. It will be a wonderful sense of achievement, I know, but I will miss this process and this excitement. Nothing quite like it. well, almost nothing ....

And thanks Victoria. You keep us on our toes! So looking forward to meeting and celebrating in Vegas! And just think .... we have all summer to bug him about his work! Elizabeth

[grinder]

Following the trail that Mark C and Paul seemed to be on. They like sort of dropped it but I think what they are saying is that there might be a possibility that there could be things "secret" .... even from the military.

OK ... say there is somebody out there like the guy who runs Virgin Airlines .... maybe somebody like him could develop something pretty special but being able to keep it secret from the US Military? ..... I find that idea sort of hard to swallow. Can't the NSA get just about any information that it wants? And if they can't get it .... how can you hide from the outfit that runs all the spy satellites ?..... the National Recconaisance Operations? How do you hide from those guys when they can read newspaper headlines from orbit? How would you even test flight something with all those guys looking over your shoulder, literally. And from a logistics point of view, how would you even communicate your business plans to get anything that secret built in the first place. Sheeeze ... I can't see that it would be possible. So if you guys have other thoughts I'd like to be proven wrong cause the idea is intriquing. Just don't know how you could do it and keep it "secret". grinder

[Chris Knight]

It's kind of interesting how Brown's name has been carried through the century.

Complete silence, then up pops Carlos Allende. Now, I have here in front of me Carlos Allende's original Seaman's Certificate of Identification dated May 31, 1925 out of the port of New York, N.Y. In any case, Allende wrote a series of letters in 1955 to M. K. Jessup, author of The Case for the UFO (then recently published in 1955) regarding the TPX. This was supposedly the first information presented on the TPX.

I think there were a couple of sentences in Invisible Horizons (Vincent Gaddis) regarding the TPX. Now, Gaddis wrote IH in 1965.

According to Carlos Allende's letters I have here (dated in 1977), he says that he was stationed on the SS Andrew Furuseth, and then spends most of the (28 page) letter berating Moore on inconsistencies, errors, and poor research, and then speaks of his brief encounters with Albert Einstein who was working on the TPX. I have to assume Allende had seen Moore's manuscript for his upcoming book.

Soon after Moore is writing about Brown (Wizard of Electrogravity, and Wizard of Electrogravity Revisited) in Saga UFO Report 1978 for the first, uncertain of the second. I wonder why Moore would pick up Brown of all people. Seems kind of an obscure scientist to focus on. Perhaps Reilly Crabb's influence.

In 1979, Moore publishes the Philadelphia Experiment with the chapter on Brown as apparently influenced by Reilly Crabb of Borderlands. Suddenly Brown = the TPX. The chapter is, of course, quite similar to Moore's articles published in 1978.

Soon come a number of people who were on the Eldridge, etc. Whether their input is of any worth is suspect.

Lots of smoke and noise. I wonder about the man behind the curtain.

Andrew

[grinder]

Andrew,

What do you mean ... you have in front of you? You have those original papers? The Seamans certificate AND papers ... or just the certificate for this "Carlos Allende" And which "letters" do you have ?.... there must be two sets, one set dated in 1955, right? And another set dated in 1977?

I have to go somewhere and get studied up on this story ... because I am sort of lost here.

The long letter you mentioned that berated Moore for "inconsistancies" was dated 1977 ...... but I thought that the book didn't come out until 1979, but maybe I am wrong. If I am not .... as you said, he must have seen an early draft???????? Would he have been in contact with Moore all along then?

How did you get all this stuff Andrew, mind my asking? Can you verify that you have the real items? Very interesting! Do these letters mention Dr. Brown at all? grinder

[Victoria Steele]

YEAH, YEAH I know I said I was sitting down for awhile. You can forget that. Them that want to have talk space had better just muscle past me.

ANDREW .... What the heck? ..... I have read your last post several times just to make sure that I am seeing things right. You have letters from Carlos Allende ?(from where? postmarked?) to Bill Moore.????? You said one letter was long and berated Moore for "inconsistancies" ( gee who would have thought about doing that?) ..... so how did you get these from Moore? I thought no one knew where he was?

So what does this letter actually say Andrew? Are you going to release the contents? I have heard that his first letters were sort of .... strange ..... would you say that too? Does he mention Dr. Brown? Victoria

[Chris Knight]

Grinder -

Sure, here is a link to Allen(de)'s original seaman certificate scan. I made an error, though, his birthday is May 31, 1925, but the certificate is dated August 20, 1943 (the certificate is a bit faded and creased - my apologies).

http://www.qualight.com/general/seaman.jpg

I have several letters from Allen(de) to Moore and Gray Barker during the period of 1977 and 1980, respectively. Here is a link to the first page of the March 12, 1977 letter.

http://www.qualight.com/general/3-12-1977.jpg

Mr. Allen(de) seems to have been quite the prolific writer (very). He also had a nasty habit of using thick marker pens to write on thin paper, which he then flipped over to write in the opposite direction. It makes for very difficult reading.

I don't have access to the 1955 letters to Jessup, and it's going to take some time to work through the information I have. You are correct, these letters were written in 1977 before Moore's TPX came out. Due to the dearth of information, I suspect that Moore relied heavily on Allen(de).

Andrew

[Chris Knight]

Victoria !!

I was telling Elizabeth earlier today a story about me and a friend when we were children (well, old enough to know better). There was a PVC drain down on the hill behind his house, and every summer a nest of yellow jackets would take up residence there. So we would take one of those big, thick plastic red baseball bats, run down the hill, beat on the drain really hard, and then run back up the hill to watch all of the yellow jackets swarm around. This was usually repeated until one or more of us got stung (most times we quit at one, sometimes we weren't so lucky).

I knew the researcher in you wouldn't want to pass up an opportunity to get on Moore's case

Now you see why I've been trying to figure out the history here. I am trying to track how Brown went from obscurity to being associated with the TPX. Allen(de) was the original source for the TPX, and I don't believe it was Moore who put the two together, but rather Reilly, so I'm gathering my notes to see if I can find anything. Unfortunately, I'm still looking, which is why I keep beating this dead horse. Soon I'll end up with hamburgers and we'll have a BBQ, but until then, I have to keep searching...

As you asked, I am trying to see if there was any mention of Brown in Allen(de)'s letters or if I can find some inferences. Some anomaly.

If I don't get a chance to type out the letters, I can bring them (along with a bottle of headache medicine) to LV in November. They're an interesting piece of history at the least.

Andrew