The bottom line on TTB?

[Trickfox]

Well my friends

What conclusions have we yet to make on all of this story with Dr. Brown?

I'm not ready to make any yet myself. In fact I hope I never have to really.

A few days ago I had a conversation with "THE OTHERS". I suppose I eventually found out who "THEY" are....

I've allways tried to be positive about everything in my whole life. I still feel that way. In fact..... I feel more alive and enlightened than I have ever been in my life.

I have questioned and meditated upon the issue of what seperates the "US" from the "THEM". I have tackled with the "What-with-nots"of finding out how to sort it all out.

Now I understand and I know. People exclude themselves from my subjective reality by insisting that they know for sure what objective reality is.

From the total analysis of the technology, and it's possible applications we can come to a single and most predominant conclusion. The end result requires that none of it need be built "but one" and it is a very subtle and very simple technology.

We are more than half way into the story, but I'm already positive that I'm on the right path to a personal quest for objective truth, but the fact is that I'm the only one who will experience it in total subjectivity and solitude.

The movie "Contact" with Jody Foster was based on a book called CONTACT written by the late Carl Sagan, for whom the spoken term; "billions and billions" will always be hear being murmured in our minds

The movie tag line was:
Get ready to take a chance on something that just might end up being the most profoundly impactful moment for humanity, for the history... of history.

Someone has come to the conclusion that I CLAIM to have made such a CONTACT experience. That is NOT what I claim. In fact I claim ONLY that I have NEVER seen ANY paranormal phenomena or event in my life.

I'm just taking a chance that I might just be able to make such CONTACT in the future, and I'm not ready to discount the fact that it will be a purely OBJECTIVE event that several million people will also witness.

That beeing said, it would be Dr, Greer's most profounding wish that such an event should happen.

Several modern Physicists and researchers are hoping that the Quantum dynamics of the universe could finally be anchored to a common consciousness phenomenon that we can objectively experience.

The fact is that someone else's complete chaos is perhaps your perfect order, and that each of us may indeed be the common anchor point of "SOME" consciousness.

Perhaps there is allways more!!

I hope there is.

Because of Kevin this morning.... I had to find out there is MORE.

Trickfox

[Trickfox]

Ok, Now that Kevin has had his say.

I would like to restart this topic Sunday morning.

What is the bottom line so far in your opinions?

Keep in mind there is more to come.

Trickfox

[grinder]

As always Trickfox, I am not entirely sure wht you are asking. But thats alright. You said bottom line, where are we at this point. So I guess any idea that comes into my head is appropriate, since its just my opinion.

I have gotten a sense for many months now that Paul is trying to tell us that what he has been dealing with is far from ordinary and in no way simple to understand. Its taken him time to get enough of a handle on it to even write it and even when his book gets out there I think it will be discussed for years to come. meant, to be that way I think.

The one thing that comes as a surprise to me is this feeling that there has been this very carefully crafted disinformation thing going on. Designed by Dr. Brown himself. Thats the different part of it. Not done to him or his work hidden but no , by him.

And as these things slowly see the light of real day through Pauls efforts I ask myself if we are going to be allowed to see the whole picture or is this just one peel of the onion?

And we are all standing in a really special moment in history. Things will never be the same when the understanding of what has gone on before starts to seep into our minds. Like Morgan said, I think, You can't go home again. Thats what we are seeing develop. And thanks to Paul learning it through the eyes of one very human and gentle individual.
grinder

[kevin.b]

From all I can glean of this man, He was simply one of the best of the best.
He put his life and limb and personal gain at risk to further and protect what may prove to be the ultimate of knowledge.

He has set a remarkably high standard , the resposibility to maintain this , and ensure the continuation of where his knowledge is used , and for positive good , is ours.
kevin

[flowperson]

Yes, kevin me lad...I believe that's it in a nutshell. And, the devils are definitely in the details methinks .

flow....

[Elizabeth Helen Drake]

kevin,

I see what you see too about Townsend Brown but I think I need to step in here so that we don't all have a tendency to build his pedestal too high. I have studied this mans life for a long time now. Longer than I would probably be prepared to admit. And the thing that comes out the sharpest in focus ( and its hard to focus on this man) is the love that he had for those around him. And along with that all of the mysteries that had never been revealed until now.

Pat and Neenie were the young people on Catalina who didn't know anything at all about Townsend Brown and his wife Josephine when they first so they had no assumptions or expectations. All you need to do is read their reactions to them to get a true picture of Josephine and Townsend. Pat and Neenie reported generally that he was gracious and helpful funny and wise ......

But that doesn't mean that Townsend Brown was perfect. He had his own particular failings. To dig up some of the most negative thoughts of him ( which is not where I like to go but really we need counterbalance here). The man had grown up expecting to have things go basically his way. (One wonders if that is bad?) His parents, especially his mother, indulged him outrageously. There are not too many chemistry students in high schools these days who have a chem lab in their own homes that are better than their schools could provide. He grew up believing that much of his world revolved around him.

The strange thing about Townsend Brown is he took this expectation in a different direction than most “ spoiled kidsâ€

[ladygrady]

I have been doing one of those things that I sometimes do when its quiet and no one is bothering me for the moment anyway. I reread what Paul has written through the posts. And I have to say especially Once you get on a roll you are one heck of a writer yourself Elizabeth dont let anyone tell you differently. You certainly delt out an understanding hand on Dr. Brown here. And thats part of what is going to make this book so important. Pauls ability with some of your feminine insight allows him
to read what we all have to say this man called Townsend Brown.

I was reading what Mr. Twigsnapper said about Dr. Brown charming the secretarys around him, (eing sincere of course, or it would not have worked, I imagine some of these executive secretaries had heard all of the bullshit lines and not much impressed them. Dr. Brown wasn't really conning them He was being genuine (but with a purpose behind it) Whatever wild combination he was able to put together certainly must have worked with the ladies in his life. Just look at his wife and his daughter!Willing, they were to go at a moments notice, anywhere he pointed.

Now here is a good question. Once Linda was settled in that new life with a husband and then a family ( a daughter? I think Paul said) did the occasion ever come up where the siren call of " Lets move to ..... wherever ".. was expressed to that family? Did Linda still chart a course with her Mother and Dad or did she leave that and follow her husbands course? I am proud of myself. I think I have asked a question no one has asked just yet. grady

[Trickfox]

Maury Island UFO Mystery

The Maury Island UFO Mystery is a complex case spanning several months in the summer of 1947 in the Puget Sound area of Washington State. The mystery occurred two weeks before Roswell and first involved UFOs seen over Maury Island, followed by the famous Kenneth Arnold sighting of UFOs over Mt. Rainier and ended with the tragic crash of a B-25 Bomber and the deaths of two military intelligence officers. This article focuses on the crash site of the B-25 Bomber, a first ever interview with a local who was first on the scene and a newly discovered photo of the crash site, believed to be the only photo available of the Air Force¹s first plane crash.

The Maury Island UFO Incident
The mystery starts with a UFO sighting by Harold Dahl on June 21, 1947, 2:00 pm over Maury Island Washington. Dahl along with his son and two crewmen were salvaging logs south of Maury Island when they saw six doughnut shaped disks hovering over the bay. One disk was wobbling and appeared to be in trouble. It lowered itself to about 500 feet above the water and was joined by five other disks. Upon what appeared to be assistance from one of the disks, the floundering disk dropped what appeared to be shiny aluminum metal on the beach followed by black lava like rock (or slag) into the water which created steam upon hitting the water. The falling slag wounded Dahl¹s son Charles and killed their dog. Charles was taken to the local hospital in Tacoma for first aid and the dog¹s body was buried at sea on their return trip. Kenneth Arnold¹s UFO Sighting Three days later on June 24, 1947, a pilot and Federal Marshall by the name of Kenneth Arnold saw nine disks ³skipping² across the North face of Mt. Rainier and was to become the sighting in which media coined the term ³Flying Saucer². He was interviewed by local and national press including Edward R. Murrow and his sighting made radio and news headlines around the world. He was later interviewed by 1st Lt. Frank M. Brown along with Capt. William L. Davidson from Hamilton Field in California.

Kenneth Arnold meets Harold Dahl and the Military
Kenneth Arnold was interested in UFOs after his sighting and answered a request by Ray Palmer - an editor in Chicago to investigate the nearby Maury Island sighting and a meeting was arranged with Harold Dahl at the Winthrop Hotel in Tacoma where Arnold was joined by United Airlines pilot Capt. E. J. Smith. The officers 1st Lt. Frank Brown and Capt. Davidson were called back at the request of Kenneth Arnold to also review these witnesses. The officers met with Kenneth Arnold and Harold Dahl and collected all the fragments of rock to take back with them to Hamilton Field. It was about midnight on July 31, 1947 when they finished interviewing and they called for a command car to pick them up as they seemed in a hurry to return to Hamiliton Field as it was Air Force Day - the inauguration day of the separation of the Air Force from the Army and all planes were needed. Kenneth Arnold in his book "The Coming of the Saucers" comments that just as the Army command car pulled up in front of the hotel where he and Capt. Smith were staying, Fred L. Crisman - Harold Dahl's supervisor came by and started taking a large Kellogg's corn flakes box (believed to be a large box with flaps) out of his trunk and Kenneth Arnold helped Crisman unload this box from his car into the trunk of the command car. Arnold states he could see the top of the box flapping open and Inside the box were a great number of large chunks of material that looked similar to the fragments we had in our room. Arnold yelled Goodbye and good luck as the command car drove away. That was the last time Arnold and Capt. Smith were to see the officers. Soon after returning to his hotel room, a Tacoma Times reporter Ted Morello called to say that a mysterious telephone informant had told him what had taken place in their hotel room. This informant's information appeared accurate to the point that Arnold thought a small transmitter had been planted somewhere in their room although they could never find one.

The B-25 Bomber Crash - the Air Force's first Fatalities
Arnold the next morning around 9:20am received a call from Fred Crisman informing him that the radio was mentioning news of a B-25 bomber that had exploded and crashed twenty minutes after take off from McChord Field. The B-25 Bomber had crashed near Kelso Washington when the left engine caught on fire. Arnold was later to hear a recorded interview by Ted Morello of Sgt. Elmer L. Taff who was one of the survivors of the plane crash. Sgt. Taff related fifteen to twenty minutes after take off it was noticed that the left engine was on fire. Sgt. Matthew's had tried the emergency fire fighting system which did not work. Then Lt. Brown squeezed through the doorway and commanded them to strap on their parachutes. Lt. Brown had his harness on but not his parachute. He harshly commanded them both to jump. Lt. Brown quickly told him how to pull the rip chord when he was sure he was clear of the ship and actually forcibly shoved him out of the plane into the night. Taff related a good ten minutes had elapsed between the time he parachuted out at 10,000 ft. until the fire reached serious proportions and the plane started to dive. Taff also related of how shortly before they took off the pilot and copilot loaded a heavy cardboard box aboard the B-25. Taff noticed it particularly because it seemed very heavy for one man to carry. This box was placed over to one side of the compartment that he and the engineer occupied. Ted Morello also informed Kenneth Arnold that the B-25 Bomber that landed at McChord Field was under military armed guard every minute it was at the field. It was implied by the nature of that statement that this was unusual and Morello was scared for their safety. 1 A local newspaper article also gave clues to what happened aboard the plane. Woodrow D. Matthews, crew chief of the bomber reported helping Davidson and Brown into their parachutes and that at the time he jumped, flames from the blazing left engine were pouring into the cockpit. It was reported that Brown was ³standing in the aisle ready to leave the plane ³ when Matthews himself jumped out. 6 Brown was found at the crash site with his parachute harness on but had apparently returned to the cockpit. His body was found in the wreckage. Matthews related that the only reason he could see that the officers did not get out was that the left wing might have crumpled, trapping them in the plane. 6 T/4 Woodrow D. Matthews, crew chief of the bomber who put the parachute on Sgt. Taff saving his life was proposed for the Soldier¹s Medal. An FBI report states the left wing was found 125 yards from the plane impact site and likely fell off throwing the plane into a plummeting spin. Later that day Kenneth Arnold again received a call from Ted Morello. The mysterious informant that kept calling Morello stated the B-25 bomber from Hamilton Field had been shot down by a 20mm cannon. The Tacoma Times that day's headlines read ³Sabotage Hinted in Crash of Army Bomber at Kelso and a sub-headline read "Plane May Hold Flying Disk Secret." Written by Paul Lance the article stated the plane had been sabotaged or shot down to prevent shipment of flying disk fragments to Hamilton Field, California, for analysis. The disk parts were said by the informant to be those from one of the mysterious platters which plunged to earth on the Maury Island recently. Leading substance to the caller's theory is the fact that twelve hours before the Army released official identification, the informant correctly identified the dead in the crash to be Capt. William L. Davidson and 1st Lt. Frank M. Brown. This Tacoma Times article also stated At McChord field an intelligence officer confirmed the informants report that the B-25 Bomber had been carrying classified material.

Paul Lance was later to die two weeks later of unknown reasons. Pathologist studied his body for thirty six hours but could not find any cause of death. Arnold was later informed that the crash was caused by the loss of an exhaust collector ring on the left engine. It was never explained by the military why Capt. Davidson and Lt. Brown never notified anyone by radio of their distress nor why they themselves did not parachute. It is likely both Davidson and Brown knew the urgency of the situation but stayed with the plane until the last moments and then it became too late. There has been no indication that the officers were conducting any additional classified missions other than interviewing the UFO sighting witnesses and carrying any other type of evidence on board. Seattle Post Intelligencer Aug. 3, 1947 AP report states "Pieces not Located" Brig. Gen. Ned Schramm, chief of staff, Fourth Air Force, said he knew nothing about reports that the plane was carrying classified or secret material. As far as I know, the plane was supposed to come in here empty he said, and there wasn't a single, solitary, secret thing aboard². 9 Air Rescue Service Final Mission Report (4) states ³at 0930PST, a message from Sq.B informed that top secret material was in the navigators kit and to request Commanding Officer McChord Field to expedite all available information to Commanding Officer Hamilton Field.

Now look at item number 2 on the NICAP reports here: http://209.132.68.98/pdf/nicap-cases.pdf

Note that this is incident number two of the newly formed NICAD research group, of which we now know Thomas Townsend Brown was a co-founder of. Can we assume that TT Brown actually met Fred Crisman back in July of 1947 during his tenure with nicap?

[Trickfox]

Maury Island UFO Mystery

The Maury Island UFO Mystery is a complex case spanning several months in the summer of 1947 in the Puget Sound area of Washington State. The mystery occurred two weeks before Roswell and first involved UFOs seen over Maury Island, followed by the famous Kenneth Arnold sighting of UFOs over Mt. Rainier and ended with the tragic crash of a B-25 Bomber and the deaths of two military intelligence officers. This article focuses on the crash site of the B-25 Bomber, a first ever interview with a local who was first on the scene and a newly discovered photo of the crash site, believed to be the only photo available of the Air Force¹s first plane crash.

The Maury Island UFO Incident
The mystery starts with a UFO sighting by Harold Dahl on June 21, 1947, 2:00 pm over Maury Island Washington. Dahl along with his son and two crewmen were salvaging logs south of Maury Island when they saw six doughnut shaped disks hovering over the bay. One disk was wobbling and appeared to be in trouble. It lowered itself to about 500 feet above the water and was joined by five other disks. Upon what appeared to be assistance from one of the disks, the floundering disk dropped what appeared to be shiny aluminum metal on the beach followed by black lava like rock (or slag) into the water which created steam upon hitting the water. The falling slag wounded Dahl¹s son Charles and killed their dog. Charles was taken to the local hospital in Tacoma for first aid and the dog¹s body was buried at sea on their return trip. Kenneth Arnold¹s UFO Sighting Three days later on June 24, 1947, a pilot and Federal Marshall by the name of Kenneth Arnold saw nine disks ³skipping² across the North face of Mt. Rainier and was to become the sighting in which media coined the term ³Flying Saucer². He was interviewed by local and national press including Edward R. Murrow and his sighting made radio and news headlines around the world. He was later interviewed by 1st Lt. Frank M. Brown along with Capt. William L. Davidson from Hamilton Field in California.

Kenneth Arnold meets Harold Dahl and the Military
Kenneth Arnold was interested in UFOs after his sighting and answered a request by Ray Palmer - an editor in Chicago to investigate the nearby Maury Island sighting and a meeting was arranged with Harold Dahl at the Winthrop Hotel in Tacoma where Arnold was joined by United Airlines pilot Capt. E. J. Smith. The officers 1st Lt. Frank Brown and Capt. Davidson were called back at the request of Kenneth Arnold to also review these witnesses. The officers met with Kenneth Arnold and Harold Dahl and collected all the fragments of rock to take back with them to Hamilton Field. It was about midnight on July 31, 1947 when they finished interviewing and they called for a command car to pick them up as they seemed in a hurry to return to Hamiliton Field as it was Air Force Day - the inauguration day of the separation of the Air Force from the Army and all planes were needed. Kenneth Arnold in his book "The Coming of the Saucers" comments that just as the Army command car pulled up in front of the hotel where he and Capt. Smith were staying, 28 year old Fred L. Crisman - Harold Dahl's supervisor(born in 1919) came by and started taking a large Kellogg's corn flakes box (believed to be a large box with flaps) out of his trunk and Kenneth Arnold helped Crisman unload this box from his car into the trunk of the command car. Arnold states he could see the top of the box flapping open and Inside the box were a great number of large chunks of material that looked similar to the fragments we had in our room. Arnold yelled Goodbye and good luck as the command car drove away. That was the last time Arnold and Capt. Smith were to see the officers. Soon after returning to his hotel room, a Tacoma Times reporter Ted Morello called to say that a mysterious telephone informant had told him what had taken place in their hotel room. This informant's information appeared accurate to the point that Arnold thought a small transmitter had been planted somewhere in their room although they could never find one.

The B-25 Bomber Crash - the Air Force's first Fatalities
Arnold the next morning around 9:20am received a call from Fred Crisman informing him that the radio was mentioning news of a B-25 bomber that had exploded and crashed twenty minutes after take off from McChord Field. The B-25 Bomber had crashed near Kelso Washington when the left engine caught on fire. Arnold was later to hear a recorded interview by Ted Morello of Sgt. Elmer L. Taff who was one of the survivors of the plane crash. Sgt. Taff related fifteen to twenty minutes after take off it was noticed that the left engine was on fire. Sgt. Matthew's had tried the emergency fire fighting system which did not work. Then Lt. Brown squeezed through the doorway and commanded them to strap on their parachutes. Lt. Brown had his harness on but not his parachute. He harshly commanded them both to jump. Lt. Brown quickly told him how to pull the rip chord when he was sure he was clear of the ship and actually forcibly shoved him out of the plane into the night. Taff related a good ten minutes had elapsed between the time he parachuted out at 10,000 ft. until the fire reached serious proportions and the plane started to dive. Taff also related of how shortly before they took off the pilot and copilot loaded a heavy cardboard box aboard the B-25. Taff noticed it particularly because it seemed very heavy for one man to carry. This box was placed over to one side of the compartment that he and the engineer occupied. Ted Morello also informed Kenneth Arnold that the B-25 Bomber that landed at McChord Field was under military armed guard every minute it was at the field. It was implied by the nature of that statement that this was unusual and Morello was scared for their safety. 1 A local newspaper article also gave clues to what happened aboard the plane. Woodrow D. Matthews, crew chief of the bomber reported helping Davidson and Brown into their parachutes and that at the time he jumped, flames from the blazing left engine were pouring into the cockpit. It was reported that Brown was ³standing in the aisle ready to leave the plane ³ when Matthews himself jumped out. 6 Brown was found at the crash site with his parachute harness on but had apparently returned to the cockpit. His body was found in the wreckage. Matthews related that the only reason he could see that the officers did not get out was that the left wing might have crumpled, trapping them in the plane. 6 T/4 Woodrow D. Matthews, crew chief of the bomber who put the parachute on Sgt. Taff saving his life was proposed for the Soldier¹s Medal. An FBI report states the left wing was found 125 yards from the plane impact site and likely fell off throwing the plane into a plummeting spin. Later that day Kenneth Arnold again received a call from Ted Morello. The mysterious informant that kept calling Morello stated the B-25 bomber from Hamilton Field had been shot down by a 20mm cannon. The Tacoma Times that day's headlines read ³Sabotage Hinted in Crash of Army Bomber at Kelso and a sub-headline read "Plane May Hold Flying Disk Secret." Written by Paul Lance the article stated the plane had been sabotaged or shot down to prevent shipment of flying disk fragments to Hamilton Field, California, for analysis.

Hamilton field in San Rafael California (near San Francisco)
The disk parts were said by the informant to be those from one of the mysterious platters which plunged to earth on the Maury Island recently. Leading substance to the caller's theory is the fact that twelve hours before the Army released official identification, the informant correctly identified the dead in the crash to be Capt. William L. Davidson and 1st Lt. Frank M. Brown. This Tacoma Times article also stated At McChord field an intelligence officer confirmed the informants report that the B-25 Bomber had been carrying classified material.

Paul Lance was later to die two weeks later of unknown reasons. Pathologist studied his body for thirty six hours but could not find any cause of death. Arnold was later informed that the crash was caused by the loss of an exhaust collector ring on the left engine. It was never explained by the military why Capt. Davidson and Lt. Brown never notified anyone by radio of their distress nor why they themselves did not parachute. It is likely both Davidson and Brown knew the urgency of the situation but stayed with the plane until the last moments and then it became too late. There has been no indication that the officers were conducting any additional classified missions other than interviewing the UFO sighting witnesses and carrying any other type of evidence on board. Seattle Post Intelligencer Aug. 3, 1947 AP report states "Pieces not Located" Brig. Gen. Ned Schramm, chief of staff, Fourth Air Force, said he knew nothing about reports that the plane was carrying classified or secret material. As far as I know, the plane was supposed to come in here empty he said, and there wasn't a single, solitary, secret thing aboard². 9 Air Rescue Service Final Mission Report (4) states ³at 0930PST, a message from Sq.B informed that top secret material was in the navigators kit and to request Commanding Officer McChord Field to expedite all available information to Commanding Officer Hamilton Field.

Now look at item number 2 on the NICAP reports here: http://209.132.68.98/pdf/nicap-cases.pdf

Note that this is incident number two of the newly formed NICAD research group, of which we now know Thomas Townsend Brown was a co-founder of.

The question is;-can we assume that TT Brown actually met Kenneth Arnold, Harold Dahl, or even 28* year old Fred L. Crisman back on or around 24th of June 1947 during his tenure as a researcher with NICAP?
Did NICAP end up with the cereal box full of items I wonder?

And while we are talking about history on another subject

Elizabeth please note "the date" of the L.K. Brown company staff photo in chapter 24. Was there any Father/son resemblance maybe?

*http://www.rr0.org/CrismanFredLee.html

Trickfox